tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post6740141710388447843..comments2023-10-19T04:51:53.516-05:00Comments on The Legal Dollar: The Changing Cost Of Law School And The Impact On New LawyersManaging Partnerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05130017520583425490noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-49811471057955278772010-01-03T18:01:06.093-06:002010-01-03T18:01:06.093-06:00nycsolo - Yes, I can see the emotional component. ...nycsolo - Yes, I can see the emotional component. It feels like we are somehow not being offered a square deal. We are willing to work and save and put away just as much as our parents did, but the costs have outpaced inflation so greatly that it is getting beyond our reach, no matter how much effort we put in. <br />I wrote a post last month on a Wall Street Journal Article about how Americans feel increasingly disheartened. Here's the URL:<br />http://thelegaldollar.blogspot.com/2009/11/wsj-article-americans-feel-increasingly.html<br /><br />I went in a different direction with the post, but certainly the phenomenon you describe is adding to our feeling of disheartenment. Here's an interesting thought - instead of just raising taxes or taking other "reactive" measures, maybe it would be better if we as a country paused and re-examined the incentives and outcomes of our system so that we can design a system that produces more or what we want. I'm not talking a socialist, stagnant, lazy-man's paradise, but instead a vibrant, productive, innovative society that is efficient and focused on moving ahead. Instead we have a bewildering maze of incentives acting at cross-purposes producing unintended consequences that sap our energy and resources.Managing Partnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05130017520583425490noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-51011848437718755102009-12-31T17:10:45.876-06:002009-12-31T17:10:45.876-06:00"It may be worth tens or hundreds of thousand..."It may be worth tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars if your kids live in a lower-cost area for a year (to establish residency) before attending school there."<br /><br />It's interesting you should say that. Part of the problem is that pretty much everyone in my family went to Ivy League schools so I feel a lot of pressure to let my children go if they get admitted, which they probably have a pretty good chance of.<br /><br />"For example, at Harvard, parents with incomes of less than $60 don't pay a dime"<br /><br />Yes, I am aware of these sorts of programs. The thing is, my wife and I together make decent money -- too much to qualify for most of them, but not enough money that I can save 600k. Unless I hit big on a few cases, which is possible but I can't plan on that happening.<br /><br />"solo practitioner and consequently would have a great deal of flexibility in determining how much income you would realize in a particular year. You may wish to review the FAFSA and Harvard policies and take an opportunity to do some planning in that regard."<br /><br />Yes, I can probably set things up so that my children will qualify for decent financial aid.<br /><br />But that's not really the point. The main point is that emotionally, I find it hard to accept that my parents were able to pay my full tuition for a top college whereas I will probably have to rely on financial aid for my own children's hypothetical future tuition.nycsolonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-12388547066831502792009-12-31T15:46:22.605-06:002009-12-31T15:46:22.605-06:00nycsolo - Thanks for the comment! It was even a s...nycsolo - Thanks for the comment! It was even a surprise to me how big the disparity was when I sat down and worked it out. It also is a wakeup call for those senior attorneys who sometimes go around and give talks about what law school and practice are like - the experiences that they had no longer reflect the financial reality. They are misrepresenting reality to the law students and should be a little more careful before they tell the students what the experiences will be like for the students. Please, please, do a little mroe due dilligence before you give someone bad advice.<br /><br />As for paying for children's tuition, you are dead on that college tuition just keeps rising and rising. Two things to consider, though: first, college expenses can be much, much less outside of the NY area. It may be worth tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars if your kids live in a lower-cost area for a year (to establish residency) before attending school there. If you had to pay $20K to support your kid living somewhere for a year and it saved you $100K on college costs, it would be a good deal, right? $20K is about all it would cost in a college town in the midwest. They could even be registered at a community college during that year earning credits that will transfer to the University.<br /><br />Second, I note that some of the more expensive schools on the east coast are giving free tuition if your income is below a certain dollar value. For example, at Harvard, parents with incomes of less than $60 don't pay a dime, they don't consider your home equity, and those students are not expected to take out loans. See these articles:<br /><br />http://www.fao.fas.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do<br />http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&sid=a_jTWOco3Se0<br /><br />From your moniker, I would imagine that you are a solo practitioner and consequently would have a great deal of flexibility in determining how much income you would realize in a particular year. You may wish to review the FAFSA and Harvard policies and take an opportunity to do some planning in that regard. Taking an extra few weeks vacation or pre-paying some expenses in order to save tens of thousands of dollars in tuition sounds like a good deal to me. How can you afford to take the vacation or do you need more than $60K/year? Pay off your mortgage before they go to college and get a home equity line if you need additional income while they are in college. As they say - the home equity is not considered. Good luck!Managing Partnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05130017520583425490noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-13887948185388405002009-12-31T12:44:24.268-06:002009-12-31T12:44:24.268-06:00I realize I'm late to this party, but I wanted...I realize I'm late to this party, but I wanted to say this was a terrific post, and it confirms what I have suspected for some time now.<br /><br />I am an attorney; my father is an attorney; and his father was an attorney. However, I would discourage my children from going to law school. It's just too expensive.<br /><br />Not only that, the same thing is happening to college tuition. I feel somewhat guilty and ashamed that I will probably not be able to pay for my childrens' college tuition the way my parents paid for mine.<br /><br />But the fact is that things have changed a lot in the last 20 years. When I was in college, tuition room and board was a bit south of 20k for a year. Perhaps 18k. So you could send two children to college for about 145k. Which is a lot of money, but if you saved and invested dilligently, it was achievable for much of the middle class.<br /><br />Heck, I could probably come up with 150k (or 230k adjusting for inflation) over the next 6 years if I really had to. <br /><br />But in 10 years, it could easily cost 600k to send two children to college.nycsolonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-51950263835533369552009-10-30T15:09:33.656-05:002009-10-30T15:09:33.656-05:001:52 - You sure are right! When I talk with older...1:52 - You sure are right! When I talk with older attorneys, I find that 1500 hours/year used to be considered a "good year". That's 30 billable hours/week, which probably took 40-45 hours or work time over the week to earn. That's a much different lifestyle.Managing Partnerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05130017520583425490noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-43831965703631850012009-10-30T13:52:44.844-05:002009-10-30T13:52:44.844-05:00Also, back in the "good ole days" it was...Also, back in the "good ole days" it was easier to get experience. As an associate you essentially carried the senior partners briefcase for a couple of years, observing and learning the practice. Now you are expected to bill 2000 plus hours, right out of the gate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3521318064826848712.post-85606994448308860112009-10-16T20:05:28.171-05:002009-10-16T20:05:28.171-05:00Amen. Sums it up perfectly.Amen. Sums it up perfectly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com